Conference gyro::internet_toolss

	I think the product you want is WinGate. Search for that.

							mike

Take a look at Wingate, available from 

http://webnz.com/qbik/wingate/download.htm (assuming you're trying to use
a Pee Sea as your gateway).

j.

    WinGate is the one to look for Win95/NT.  
    
    If one of your machines happens to be Linux or another UNIX, you don't
    need WinGate.
    
    -Tom

	How adventurous are you?  If you can leave the Wintel comfort zone,
	check out Linux.  This is a UNIX clone that runs on Intel 386 and
	higher CPUs, and it is available for FREE.

	I am using Linux to do just what you are talking about (among other
	things.) I have a local network with Linux as the gateway to the
	internet doing:
	- Routing
	- Firewall
	- IP Masquerading
	- PPP -> ISP with dynamic IP address assignment
	- Demand-dial
	- Intranet Web server (using Apache, the #1 server on the internet)

	Again, all of the above is available for FREE via the net (including
	X-windows.)  If you are not familiar with UNIX, there will be a steep
	learning curve but, you can have a lot of fun with it.

 Hi there,

   ditto with .4, I have a linux gateway with a firewall (free from TIS Trusted Information Systems
http://www.tis.com there is an active mailing list here also) running a number of NT and w95 machines behind it.
The linux machine is a 133 mhz 486 with 10 mg and 500mg disk (relatively high spec from what I've seen of others
who are on the mailing list). If you have Unix experience then setting it up (at least I found) was relatively
straight forward but time consuming. 

   My only advice is to try and find a 'guru' who has done this before and bounce questions off them for
direction. The documentation is ok (it's free what can you expect) but the mailing list and archive tends to
answer most questions. 

   As regards .4  "...you can have a lot of fun with it...", generous use of the word fun, but I would say that it
is satisfying when it's up and running.
 
    If you want more information, you can give me a shout, although I'm on holidays for the next two weeks.

  Richard 

    Wow.  You mean I'm not crazy?  
    
    I thought this was doable with the available tools on NT Server.  Okay,
    just to be sure:  I want one system dialed in to my ISP, and the other
    system able to surf *through* the first one.
    
    I had guessed that I needed a gateway.  Is that really true?  There's
    no alternative other than buying specialized gateway software?  How
    much is it? (or did someone provide that info already?)
    
    jeb
    
    (P.S.  I actually have a linux CD at home.  But I'm not quite sure
    whether I want to dedicate a machine to running it full time)
    

I would think that if machine A is on the net via an isp, and
machine B is hardwired ("thinwire??") to machine A, then machine
B will just automatically be on the net without special software.

Why is this not the case ?

/Eric

>    I thought this was doable with the available tools on NT 
>    Server.  Okay, just to be sure:  I want one system dialed 
>    in to my ISP, and the other system able to surf *through* 
>    the first one.

Typically, your ISP will only assign a single address to you, and
would not route to multiple systems (they tend to charge more 
for a connection like that).  So, you need a way to make the 
connections from the second machine appear to be coming from 
the first one.  This is usually done by a proxy server.  Microsoft
is selling one now, also ($995 suggested retail price).  The
Wingate product is free for a single user, $60 for 2 users.

http://www.microsoft.com/proxy/default.asp

http://www.deerfield.com/wingate/

Re: .7,
> I would think that if machine A is on the net via an isp, and
> machine B is hardwired ("thinwire??") to machine A, then machine
> B will just automatically be on the net without special software.
> 
> Why is this not the case ?

Because machine A will have an address assigned by your ISP
(e.g 207.159.144.128).  What address do you give B?  Requests
going out on the Internet will have B's address and there will
be no way to route the packets back. To make this work, A would
have to have routing enabled and B's address would somehow have
to be routed back through A (ISPs typically do not let you send
out routes or pay attention to them if you did). As I said
in my previous note, if they do this, it typically costs more
than a personal connection with a single dynamic address assigned.

When you use a proxy, the requests will go out with A's address,
which can be routed back.  The proxy server on A will then
forward them to B.

    Okay, one last question.  There's a bug in Windows 95 that sometimes
    prevents a Windows 95 system from simultaneously dialing into an ISP
    *and* participating in a local area network (LAN), for example, an
    Ethernet network (I know there's a patch - at least in my case it
    didn't fix the problem).
    
    I assume that this works OK with Windows NT?  I don't actually need NT
    Server? (I looked at the page, and didn't see a specific requirement
    for NT Server).
    
    jeb
    

    � Okay, one last question.  There's a bug in Windows 95 that sometimes
    � prevents a Windows 95 system from simultaneously dialing into an ISP
    � *and* participating in a local area network (LAN), for example, an
    � Ethernet network (I know there's a patch - at least in my case it
    � didn't fix the problem).
    

Windows NT has an even more insipid set of routing problems, but I'll let
you have fun discovering them :-).  In a nutshell, they think that for
multihomed systems, it's perfectly appropriate to drop a packet on the
wrong adapter, hence routing an IP packet that can never return (it has
the wrong source address).

There's no bug in Windows 95 that I know of that won't allow you to participate
in a LAN and also a dial-up.  I do that all the time.  There is a bug that
won't allow you to have 2 ethernet adapters and a dial-up connection - your
dial-up connection would get an address of 0.0.0.0 and your IP stack would
be pretty corrupt.  That was fixed with the Microsoft ISDN Accelerator
Pack (V1.1).

j.

	If all you need are http, ftp, gopher and other protocols supported
  by an HTTP Proxy Server, you can use run a proxy server on your dialout machine.
  If you expect to do anything else it gets MUCH more complicated.  What exactly
  do you want to do?  As others have explained, unless the system you are trying
  to reach can send packets back to you, it can't be done.  All schemes whether
  they be based on NT or Unix need to have a way of sending out packets that
  the other machine can successfully respond to by sending it to the system
  that you are using to dial out.  This happens either because you have systems
  behind it that have unique IP addresses and that system is recognized as the
  route back or that you have wrapped the packets in some way that the machine
  sends it back to the dialout machine which will in turn unwrap the request
  and forward it to the correct machine.

		Danny

    >If all you need are http, ftp, gopher and other protocols supported by
    >an HTTP Proxy Server, you can use run a proxy server on your dialout
    >machine.
    
    This is really all I need to do.  Does NT offer a proxy service, or do
    I need a separate product?  Or is that all WinGate really is?
    
    jeb
    

>    >If all you need are http, ftp, gopher and other protocols supported by
>    >an HTTP Proxy Server, you can use run a proxy server on your dialout
>    >machine.
>    
>    This is really all I need to do.  Does NT offer a proxy service, or do
>    I need a separate product?  Or is that all WinGate really is?

	It's not part of NT.  You can install Purveyor which supports proxying
  and if it's for you.  There's also an Intel version of Netscape's Proxy
  Server for NT.  These can be installed either on NT Workstation or NT Server.
  Microsoft also has a proxy server, but it requires NT Server.  There are also
  a number of third-party proxy servers.  Wingate is useful to handle the dialout
  stuff.

		Danny

    re: .13
    
    No, NT does not include any proxy services.
    
    WinGate is a general proxy server. You can set it up to proxy any port
    and any protocol, which allows you to pass through not only http, ftp,
    gopher, etc., requests, but also telnet, SMTP, POP, DNS, or anything
    else.
    
    WWW proxy servers, some of which Danny mentioned, are more limited.
    They will allow you to service only http protocol requests from your
    local clients, and pass on anything that can be proxied via http.
    That's generally limited to http, ftp, gopher, and WAIS. However, you
    can't run a conventional ftp client through it, for example, and if
    your clients also needed, for example, DNS or SMTP, you'd have to run
    those servers on your gateway as well as the http proxy server.
    
    -Tom